Take the Math Dot Test

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2008/09/15/science/20080915_NUMBER_SENSE_GRAPHIC.html

I am able to discern one dot difference. I am able to score a perfect score on this test. I am good at math, I see the girl spinning clockwise. If I can tell one dot difference certainly a baby who has the ability can. In order to get it right they have to flashed fast so you will use your right brain. Go with your instinct (right brain) to get them right. I think this proves the Doman method. We can discern quantity with our right brain. This is an inante abilty we are born with, maybe some more then others. If you have this ability, you are good in math. So training your baby to do this should improve their ability in math.

This test has convinced me. If I can do it, surely a baby who has not lost his abilities yet can do better.

I am curious what results is everyone getting please post your results.

I didn’t do as well as you. I’m below average at 73%. But it was fun trying. I hope my baby will do better than me. :wink:

I enjoyed this activity but only achieved a score in the low 80s.

It takes a while to focus and concentrate. At first when I wasn’t focusing, the dots came and went too rapidly, and I started with an average of just over 50%. After focusing and getting into the rhythm, I pulled the average up to over 75%.

I took he test ten times and got 9/10 score of 90% woohoo

I’m 92 in this test.
ed

See our brains can perceive quantities, so obviously babies can too!

I got 92.

I got 100

Hmmm, I got 100 twice in 10 tests but math isn’t my strong point. Attached is my score :slight_smile:

Something to note though, I read fairly fast so maybe this test rely greatly on how “fast” your eyes can scan the page? I’m pretty sure that I cannot perceive quantities or know the difference between 88 and 89 dot card! I don’t think this exam tests quantity perception :smiley:


Your right brain math abilities are used for comparison of quantities and if you are able to get 10 out of 10 you are using this ability. It does have to do with perceiving the difference in quantities (comparisons) and not counting. You may be very good in Math, but it may be society values that have convinced you that you are not.

Possibly your ability to read fast allows you to focus and use this ability better then others. I think we all have this ability to do this if you are able to focus and scan quickly. Your training to read fast probably is related to your ability to do this. Your ability to read fast would not tell you which one has more that is quantity and has nothing to do with reading. Did you count them in your mind? If you didn’t count them then you perceived quantity.

That makes sense! =) Maybe it’s just my attitude towards math (it’s my least favorite!). One theory I’m pondering upon is maybe this exam tests how our eyes sees more yellow than blue & vice versa…it’s a matter of “seeing” the more dominant color and not actually counting quantities. Why didn’t it use same colors? (like show pure blue dots on one slide and more on the other and asks us which is more?)

I got 78 now, maybe try again when I can concentrate better. I am right when both colors are spread out and wrong when they are in different parts of the screen, so I think I am “matching the pairs”, is that counting?
Math was my favorite in school…

I did 25 tests and scored 88. Pretty cool!

I took the test a few more times and found that i was able to get a much higher score-didn’t repeat at least 25 times as required to obtain an accurate result-my average result might have been lower had i continued. The site indicates that the average result is around 75%, but doesn’t indicate the average score of people good at maths-presumably the difference is measurable but might not be that much higher.
The test is a measure of our ability to compare quantity and here is a list of the quantities over several tests.

10-12 15-11 13-8 7-5 12-8 10-6 10-8 10-7 12-6 10-5 8-7 10-5 8-5 9-12 11-5 10-7 12-9 7-5 6-5 12-15 15-10 9-11

As you can see -the difference between the colors is significant on most. Ratio as with research with babies matters

“Experiments 1 and 2 investigated whether infants/babies ’ numerosity discrimination depends on the ratio of the two set sizes with even larger numerosities. Infants successfully discriminated between arrays of 16 vs. 32 discs, but not 16 vs. 24 discs, providing evidence that their discrimination shows the set-size ratio signature of numerosity discrimination in human adults, children, and many non-human animals.”

The latest research appears to confirm that babies can subitize. Many studies suggest that babies can distinguish quantities up to three (Starkey & Cooper, 1980; Starkey,Spilke&Gelman1990;Strauss & Curtis 1981) This is shown by habituation studies. So long as the numbers are within their subitization range they do not seem to be dependent on the pattern in which the objects are arranged. If a baby is habituated to three items arranged in a triangular pattern (s)he will still treat them as the same old three if they are represented in a straight line. This contrasts with their reaction to numbers over 3. Tan and Bryant(2000) found that these can be recognized if, and only if, the pattern remained the same.

“the error in numerosity representations is
proportional to numerical magnitude, and therefore discriminability between two
numerosities depends on their ratio”

(Starkey & Cooper, 1980):
Slides were projected on a screen in front of babies sitting on their mother’s lap.
The time a baby spent looking at each slide before turning away was carefully
monitored. When the baby started looking elsewhere, a new slide appeared on
the screen. At first, the slides contained two large black dots. During the trials,
the baby was shown the same numbers of dots, though separated horizontally
by different distances. After a while, the baby would start looking at the slides
for shorter and shorter periods of time. This is technically called habituation;
nontechnically, the baby got bored.
The slides were then changed without warning to three black dots. Immediately
the baby started to stare longer, exhibiting what psychologists call a longer
fixation time. The consistent difference of fixation times informs psychologists
that the baby could tell the difference between two and three dots. The experiment
was repeated with the three dots first, then the two dots. The results were
the same. These experiments were first tried with babies between four and five
months of age, but later it was shown that newborn babies at three or four days
showed the same results (Antell & Keating, 1983). These findings have been
replicated not just with dots but with slides showing objects of different shapes,
sizes, and alignments (Strauss & Curtis, 1981). Such experiments suggest that
the ability to distinguish small numbers is present in newborns, and thus that
there is at least some innate numerical capacity.

Well you are right seeing more of one color definitely is part of this test. That is how I determine which is more by which color I see in my mind after it flashes. I am sure that is why they have different size dots so that is not the case. In some of these test I am sure the one with less dots may have bigger dots. I haven’t really examined this but I am sure this is the case. The different sizes should resolve the question of seeing more area in one color.

Yes Chris, several of the comparisons are more then 1 or 2 dots apart. If we are scoring high 80s to 100 we are getting the more complicated comparisions right. The different size dots also effect the results and make getting the right answer more difficult. If this many people are scoring high I say there is an inherent ability and not simply cuing as you suggest.

Hi Patreiche, Pls see amended reply above-i think your response arrived as i was adding research evidence-
“Experiments 1 and 2 investigated whether infants/babies ’ numerosity discrimination depends on the ratio of the two set sizes with even larger numerosities. Infants successfully discriminated between arrays of 16 vs. 32 discs, but not 16 vs. 24 discs, providing evidence that their discrimination shows the set-size ratio signature of numerosity discrimination in human adults, children, and many non-human animals.”

I agree that it is an inherent ability but it does not support the claims made by IAHP. Please try the following test-

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6577241.stm

It sounds like all your studies do not flash the slides at a high rate of speed which is the key to the test I posted and to right brain math. KL will we be able to change the speed the math cards are flashed at? If the slides are not flashed at a high rate of speed which is what I read in your post but instead changed when the baby turns away then they do not relate to this test. Yes I have taken your other test and the two things do not relate. In your test we are counting not perceiving quantity, big difference. The right brain only kicks in on comparisons because we have been taught language of math (counting etc) which is totally different part of the brain. Did you read that one article I posted on the two areas of brain involved in math. You are trying to compare apples and oranges.

Why are there no examples of babies/infants that are able to give verbal responses?

I know that the tests measure different things-just concerned by the 0% success rate of GD maths with regard to verbal response.

Baby brains are hard-wired for math-Analysis illustrated that babies have similar brain activity to that of adults when served with correct and incorrect mathematical solutions.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14254290/

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=9BFAX55W1TQ&eurl=http://forum.brillkids.com/teaching-your-child-math/glenn-doman-mathsdot-maths/msg16338/